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Kiskinis : Kiskinis Family
Please I am trying to locate my ancestors from Borsod-Abauj-Zemplen Megye in Kiskinizs. The town is named after my
surname. Please can someone Help. I am from Houston Texas.
I am trying to establish the Kiskinis Hungarian Link.

Please Help
Adam Kiskinis
27/03/2005, 08:55:03
#: 2005031188

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Kiskinis : Kiskinis Family
Please I am trying to locate my ancestors from Borsod-Abauj-Zemplen Megye in Kiskinizs. The town is named after my
surname. Please can someone Help. I am from Houston Texas.
I am trying to establish the Kiskinis Hungarian Link.

Please Help
Adam Kiskinis
27/03/2005, 08:57:33
#: 2005031189

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Zlatica : Re: Kiskinis Family
Adam

Few sites :
www.rat.de/kuijsten/navigator (surname navigator)
The old 1910 Hungarian megye map is at :
http://lazarus.elte.hu/hun/maps/1910
The LDS-Mormons website is listing church records of Kiskinizs, Abauj-Torna megye, Hungary You can order them and gather ancestral information.
www.bmi.net/jjaso to familiarize yourself with church wording.
www.fam.aust.com/topolcsany/names a first name translation website
Hungary's phone site www.matav.hu/tudakozo/index_e.html
Is that the town your ancestor was actually born in ?
27/03/2005, 15:23:54
#: 2005031211

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Kiskinis: Re: Kiskinis Family
Zlatica

I am not sure if my ancestor was born there? I know for a fact there are not place names in the world with
the name Kiskinizs. Kiskinizs is the Hungarian equivalent to Kiskinis the Greek Version and Kiskini the Italian Version. We are part of the Vlach tribe. We were traders in the Balkan for hundreds of years. Also we tended to thousand heads of sheep and had our own communities throughout the Balkans including weapons to repel invaders into our domain throughout the mountains. I am thinking we left the Balkans to escape the Turks and ended up Hungary
thus naming a city after our clan Kiskinizs.
13/09/2005, 21:48:30
#: 200509478

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Kiskinis: Re: Kiskinis Family
Zlatica

I am not sure if my ancestor was born there? I know for a fact there are not place names in the world with
the name Kiskinizs. Kiskinizs is the Hungarian equivalent to Kiskinis the Greek Version and Kiskini the Italian Version. We are part of the Vlach tribe. We were traders in the Balkan for hundreds of years. Also we tended to thousand heads of sheep and had our own communities throughout the Balkans including weapons to repel invaders into our domain throughout the mountains. I am thinking we left the Balkans to escape the Turks and ended up Hungary
thus naming a city after our clan Kiskinizs.
13/09/2005, 21:48:36
#: 200509479

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Zlatica: Re: Kiskinis Family
Adam

I found no KISKINISs coming thru Ellis Island to America but the SSDI is listing 3. http://ssdi.rootsweb.com
You know that you start the research with what you know, YOU and proceed until you locate the ancestor that came from "old country". You need a place of birth.
You do know that there is a town named Kiskinizs in Hungary? www.jewishgen.org/ShtetlSeeker/loctown.htm
14/09/2005, 04:04:19
#: 200509484

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cseremke: Re: Kiskinis Family
Hi!

Kiskinizs is a small village on north-east Hungary. my mother was born there and I have relatives there...

Edina
09/02/2006, 16:07:13
#: 200602569

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Adam Kiskinis: Re: Kiskinizs Family
Yes Edina are you part of the Kiskinis Family? If you are
it would be great so we could exchange information. I am
supposed to order some Hungarian Church records and
do some research. Hopefully I can locate my great great
Kiskinizs ancestor from Hungary. We are from Northern Greece, Samarina. You must be my relative if you are form Kiskinizs. Then you must know about the Vlach tribe also
if you are Kiskinizs. Please Help Me find out. Do you know the name Maniakas. It was our surname before we became Kiskinizs.

CIAO
Adam Kiskinis
Houston, Texas
10/02/2006, 00:52:09
#: 200602586

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Adam Kiskinis: Re: Kiskinizs Family
Yes Edina are you part of the Kiskinis Family? If you are
it would be great so we could exchange information. I am
supposed to order some Hungarian Church records and
do some research. Hopefully I can locate my great great
Kiskinizs ancestor from Hungary. We are from Northern Greece, Samarina. You must be my relative if you are form Kiskinizs. Then you must know about the Vlach tribe also
if you are Kiskinizs. Please Help Me find out. Do you know the name Maniakas. It was our surname before we became Kiskinizs.

CIAO
Adam Kiskinis
Houston, Texas
10/02/2006, 00:54:07
#: 200602587

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TJanos: Re: Kiskinizs Family
Hello Adam!

It may be disappointing for you to realize that the Hungarian "Kiskinizs" (literally meaning Little-Kinizs, as there is one "Nagykinizs", i.e. "Great-Kinizs" as well in the vicinity!!) has nothing to do whatsoever with the Greek (Vlach) term of "Kinis". "Kinizs" (pronounced "kinizh") was named after its founder (owner)around 1000-1050 (with no Vlachs/Greeks around at that time!), and became the seat of the noble "Kinizsi" (meaning: "from Kinizs") clan, whose most renowned member was Pál Kinizsi (died 1492), an army general of king Matthias of Hungary (ruled 1458-1490).
All this only indicates that - as very often happens - similarities of spelling can easily mislead one, resulting in totally wrong conclusions. To really find a possible connection between such similarities is a complex task, requiring strenuous efforts, such as historical/linguistic studies and the like.

All the same, do not lose heart!

Regards, TJanos
10/02/2006, 13:54:05
#: 200602605

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Kiskinis: Re: Kiskinizs Family
Dear TJanos:

Thank you so much for the information and linguistics
in Hungarian Surname Placenames. I am not fluent
in the Hungarian language. This is most useful
information in the breakdown of Kiskinizs Family
Surname.

But Mr. TJanos how do you explain the Crest for the
City Kiskinizs in Hungary. I have attached the image
as well as the hyperlink for the city. How do you
explain the Vlach Shepherd's Staff, as well as the
Tsarouxi shoe that the Vlachs wear? In addition the
background includes a warehouse stable that resembles
very much a location where they stored the sheep? Can
you explain this? This is very typical of Vlach
Culture. Or is this just a mere coincidence?

Most Sincerely and thank you for your time and
expertise in this matter.


Adam Kiskinis
Clayton Genealogical Research Library
Houston Public Library

http://www.terkepcentrum.hu/index.asp?tid=3762

This image is attached to the message.
To see the image in original size, please click on it.
13/02/2006, 23:20:32
#: 200602795

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TJanos: Re: Kiskinizs Family
Dear Adam,

As to the blazon for Kiskinizs: maybe due to the bad quality of your attachment, I cannot detect on it the objects you are referring to; I also tried the direct link, which produced the same pics. To clarify matters for details, I called up this morning the city council of Kiskinizs for information, but only tomorrow will they be available for my questions. I will revert on this to you. For the time being please have some info from the "Etymological Lexicon for Place Names" by Kiss Lajos, published in 1978 by Akadémiai Kiadó (in Hungarian) on the "Kiskinizs" entry: "Place in Borsod-Abaúj-Zemplén county, first written record in 1246 as "Kenys". In 1408: "Kynis". (N.B. In old Hungarian the "s" also stood for "zh", as testified by scores of traditionally written family names! So the name "Sidó" is pronounced as "zhidó" in modern Hungarian!)The "Kinizs" place name is of Slavic origin, Serbo-Croatian/Slovene/Czech: Knež, meaning "of prince/princely". The "Kis" prefix (meaning "Little")serves the same purpose as "Nagy" (meaning "Great"); see my previous message to you. The same Slavic root occurs in other place names throughout Hungary, such as:Balatonkenese, Nagykanizsa, etc.

Now as to the Vlachs in Hungary: first written records on them date from between 1180-1200, initially in the southernmost parts of Transylvania (presently in Romania) where they were grazing their flocks of sheep.In the following decades they gradually moved along the ridges of the Carpathian mountains, ultimately getting as far as southern Poland and eastern Moravia (now Czech Republic)in the far North. Place names in these areas testify to their early presence; however, as I showed to you, "Kiskinizs" is not one of them. Moreover,all such places bearing Vlach names are in alpine regions, as is becoming to the Valchs' earliest trade (sheep-breedeing), and the neighbourhood of "Kiskinizs" and "Nagykinizs" (gently sloping hills)is surely different geographically! And lastly: when the Hungarian tribes came to the Carpathian Basin (between 890 and 900 AD) they took over many place names from the already (sparsely)present Slavic populace; new settlements, however, were named invariably in Hungarian. So it follows that "Kiskinizs" (or rather its predecessor "Kinizs" as the "Kis" prefix is Hungarian!) was founded and named by Slavs before 890, at which time the Vlachs were still residing deep in the Southern/Central Balkans!

All in all: all applicable approaches to your question seem to refute your theory.

Regards, TJanos
14/02/2006, 14:05:58
#: 200602823

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Kiskinis Family: Re: Kiskinizs Family
Dear Mr. Janos, thanks again for the linguistics lesson in Hungarian. I will look at the Lexicon that you have mentioned and reference that for my records. Fortunately, I was able to enhance and enlarge the Blazon image using proper digital software and thus render what the objects in the image resembled the background of Vlach Culture the shoe, shepherds staff, and storage building. Perhaps Vlachs migrated there and took the name of the city Kiskinizs. Who knows? Anything is possible. There were a lot of migrations back then and also mixing of blood the races and the hiring of mercenaries Vlachs.

Thank you for contacting the city council of Kiskinizs Now I patiently await the reply from the city council of Kiskinizs. Maybe they can tell us the origin of the Blazon. Perhaps my ancestors Vlachs migrated there for business and took the name Kiskinizs as their surname? There were many migrations into Eastern Europe back and forth also many tribes were hired as mercenaries.

Thanks Again for looking into my matter.

Yours Sincerely
Adam Kiskinis

15/02/2006, 18:32:23
#: 200602907

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kezdi: Re: Kiskinizs Family
Adam,
It's only speculation on my part, for more ask czoborferi/Czobor Feri in this forum, he's very knowledgable about Romanian subjects. You're absulately correct about mercenaries, some of them were called Kenez, look for that name here also, I remember it was discussed before. Kis=Small/Lesser could mean Vice/Deputy, so perhaps originated from that.
Joseph
15/02/2006, 19:03:59
#: 200602908

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Kiskinis Family: Re: Kiskinizs Family
ATTN: MR. Czoborferi/Czobor Feri

I was referred to you by a knowledgeable gentleman in Hungarian Genealogy from this Forum Mr. T.Janos. My surname is Kiskinis and I am of Vlach Heritage. Mr. T. Janos stated that you might have some scholarly information on the term "Kenez". I would like to know the history and the origin of this word. From Mr. T. Janos findings the word "Kenez" could also mean mercenaries.
Do you have any more information on the word "Kenez"

Take Care T. Janos I am patiently awaiting the findings from the Kiskinizs City Council. Thanks you again so much for your time in contacting them. This is such a cool Forum for Genealogy.

Library Service Specialist Adam Kiskinis
Clayton Genealogical Research Library
Houston, Texas
15/02/2006, 19:43:51
#: 200602913

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Kiskinis Family: Re: Kiskinizs Family
ATTN: MR. Czoborferi/Czobor Feri

I was referred to you by a knowledgeable gentleman in Hungarian Genealogy from this Forum Mr. T.Janos. My surname is Kiskinis and I am of Vlach Heritage. Mr. T. Janos stated that you might have some scholarly information on the term "Kenez". I would like to know the history and the origin of this word. From Mr. T. Janos findings the word "Kenez" could also mean mercenaries.
Do you have any more information on the word "Kenez"

Take Care T. Janos I am patiently awaiting the findings from the Kiskinizs City Council. Thanks you again so much for your time in contacting them. This is such a cool Forum for Genealogy.

Library Service Specialist Adam Kiskinis
Clayton Genealogical Research Library
Houston, Texas
15/02/2006, 19:44:47
#: 200602914

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TJanos: Re: Kiskinizs Family
Hello Adam!

This morning I talked with a lady from the Kiskinizs city council (by the name of Mrs Takács Jánosné, tel. 46-474-205), who was not very knowledgeable on the subject but promised to dig up the detailed description of the blazon (as it is "chartered" for Kiskinizs) in accordance with heraldic stipulations! I will translate and forward this to you as soon as I have it.

Now, I must correct you in your message to Mr Czobor Feri, as it was not myself but a fellow researcher, a Mr "Joseph", who has referred your enquiry to the aforementioned gentleman. As for myself, I would never equal "kenez" with "mercenary", as the former unequivocally indicates in Hungarian history (as late as the 13-15th centuries!) LEADERS of freshly arrived colonists, mainly Vlachs, who were called in by the King to settle EXCLUSIVELY on hitherto uninhabited/peripheral border areas, to which "Kiskinizs" and vicinity never belonged - considering the 11-13th century extension of the Hungarian Kingdom!(Note, however, that "Kenez" is the same Slavic word as "Knež", that is "prince"!). And mercenaries were not hired by Hungarian kings before King Matthias (1458-90), by whose time both "Kiskinizs" and "Nagykinizs" (as well as "Kenese", "Kanizsa" etc.) had long been firmly founded, so again no link can be established to Vlachs in this respect, either.

Ragards, TJanos
15/02/2006, 20:48:33
#: 200602925

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kezdi: Re: Kiskinizs Family
A Kenez was perhaps not a mercenary but an agent for landlords, in charge of recruting settlers mostly from outside of Hungary. Duties included besides recruiting, transportation, building the new settlements than staying on as "sherif" to ensure the new settlements stability.
15/02/2006, 22:37:58
#: 200602927

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Akiskinis: Re: Kiskinizs Family
16/02/2006, 00:27:43
#: 200602930

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Akiskinis: Re: Kiskinizs Family
Thanks for your information.


Adam Kiskinis
16/02/2006, 00:30:16
#: 200602931

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Kiskinis Adam: Re: Kiskinizs Family
Dear Mr. T. Janos I am looking at some documents by

1.Hungarians and Rumanians in the Torrents of History by Alain Du Nay, Editura Matthias Corvinus Buffalo, Toronto
2001 Trans. Bogsanyi Denes.

2. The Daco Roman Legend, Christian Cultic Places In Transylvania by Arpad, Kosztin, Matthias Corvinus Publishing, Hamilton Buffalo

There are plenty of references to Vlachs in these sources also reference to Transylvania, Hungary, kenezships, voivods and many more. I will need to do some research in this area.

Thanks for all your help

Adam Kiskinis


16/02/2006, 00:40:25
#: 200602932

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