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Ken Forbes: Catherine Lipics / Lipech-Krecsmár / Kreczmár
My great-grandmother, Theresa Krecsmár-Bogár (1883-1954), indicated that she hailed from "Washmay," Austria-Hungary on her SSN application. The embassy in Budapest says that may be a phonetic spelling of "Vas Meyge." Johann and Theresa apparently came to the USA about the year 1906.

Great-grandmother married a fellow named Johann Bogár (1880-1917). In the same New Jersey neighborhood where she lived, was a man named Stephen Bogár (1883-1966). I suspect he was Johann's brother, and he hailed from Ottoháza, Vas Megye, Hungary, which is now Otovci, Puconci, Slovenia. Stephen Bogár married a gal named Gisela. That was also my grandmother's name.

I'm looking for additional information and kinfolk connections.

JOHANN'S PARENTS: Gyergy Bogár married Zsuzsa 'Daisy' Kovács

THERESA'S PARENTS: John Krecsmár / Kreczmár married Catherine Lipics / Lipech

JOHANN'S BROTHER??: Stephen Bogár married Gisela

I guess they could also be from the town of Vasmegyer in Szabolcs county, Hungary.
2004/12/26, 07:11:53
#: 200412730

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Zlatica : Re: Catherine Lipics / Lipech-Krecsmár / Kreczmár
Ken

Did your ancestor come thru Ellis Island? Did you locate their manifest?
There was an Istvan BOGAR coming thru EI in 1908 from Ottohaz, Vas, going to Bethlehem, PA,left a father Ignatz Bognar in Ottohaz.
Here is a first name translation website :
www.fam.aust.com/topolcsany/names
A website to familiarize yourself with church wording:
www.bmi.net/jjaso
Hungary's phone site : www.matav.hu/english/index.html or
http://tudakozo.matav.hu
2004/12/26, 07:50:54
#: 200412734

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Ken Forbes: Janos Bajor Laraspdek??
Thank you for the help.

This is what my uncle has to say as far as their language is concerned. I don't know if it helps much.

-- "Speaking about Austria, my Grandmother came from Austria/Hungary. Her first language was Hungarian and Austrian was second - English came in as a poor third. I had to understand German (Austrian) and Hungarian when I visited her as a kid." --

ME? Tessie died in 1954. I was born in 1955. I never knew my great-grandparents.

Theresa was naturalized in either 1906 or 1916. There's a smudge where the "0" or "1" should be.

I did go back and read Stephen Bogar's SSN application (135-07-3223). He lived at 83 Lang Street, Newark in 1936. This is just a few blocks away from my great-grandmother's place at 79 Van Buren Street. Stephen reported his place of birth was Otovci, Jugo-Slavia. His parents were Gyergy Bogar and Zsuzsa Kovacs. I've associated (guess) this Ellis Island Record with him:

Bogar, Stefan
Magyar Hungarian
Otohasa, Hungary
April 19, 1913
30y
M
M
Vaderland
Antwerp, Belgium

Johann's death certificate shows Bojar and Bogar as his surname. His father's birthplace and name were "unknown" on the cert., but his mother is shown as "Daisy" born in "Hungary."

Theresa shows her name as "Tessie Kirchmeyer" on her SSN app. It also shows "Washmay, Hungary" as the place of birth. [No doubt this is because the record taker was phonetically spelling her answers] Her son recorded "Kercmar" as her maiden name on her death cert., along with "Austria-Hungary" as the place of birth. My mother tells me that her maiden name was "Kreczmar." My uncle also recorded "Kreczmar" on her death cert. A Hungarian national tells me it may have been spelled "Krecsmár."

Perhaps, associating Stephen Bogar with my Bogars is premature.

THe best match, so far, for Johann Bajor is as follows:

First Name: Janos
Last Name: Bajor
Ethnicity: Hungary
Last Place of Residence: Laraspdek
Date of Arrival: December 07, 1906
Age at Arrival: 25y
Gender: M
Marital Status: M
Ship of Travel: Graf Waldersee
Port of Departure: Hamburg
Manifest Line Number: 0006


There are two Janos Bogars who come close to mine, but their DOB is off by a few years:

Bogar, Janos
Hungary, Slovak
Te...Vakarvar, Hungary
September 03, 1907
24y
M
M
Ultonia
Carnaro, Triest, Austria


Bogar, Janos
Hungary, Magyar
Ottohaza, Hungary
February 20, 1911
28y
M
M
Lapland
Antwerp, Belgium
2004/12/27, 00:56:34
#: 200412762

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Zlatica : Re: Janos Bajor, Sarospatak
Ken

The www.stevemorse.org site is not working but this one is :
www.jewishgen.org/databases/EIDB/ellis.html
2004/12/27, 16:19:51
#: 200412783

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Ken Forbes: Re: Janos Bajor, Sarospatak
Thank you for correcting the spelling of Sarospatak. I would have spent hours trying to find Laraspdek.

I now have many more possible choices for Johann with your help. This one looks promising. His intention, as shown on the shipping manifest, was to go to Edgewater, New Jersey. That's less than 20 miles from where I was born and grew up. Presently, I reside on America's west coast in Washington State outside the city of Tacoma.
2004/12/28, 04:08:07
#: 200412808

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kezdi: Re: Janos Bajor, Sarospatak
Ken, I have couple comments and questions which hopefully will help.
Did any of Theresa or Johann parents came to the US? The reason I ask is, how did Zsuzsa Kovács got the "Daisy" nickname, in Hungary it's not used, it would be Margareth(a), perhaps her middle name.
My other question is regarding "Johann's death certificate shows Bojar and Bogar as his surname". Were they not sure of the name, and how did you get to Bajor from Bojar, Bogar? Sárospatak is in eastern Hungary, Vas is in quite a distance from it in the west.
"Theresa shows her name as "Tessie Kirchmeyer" on her SSN app.", when do you think it was changed to Krecsmar?
This one also intrigued me, "I suspect he was Johann's brother, and he hailed from Ottoháza, Vas Megye, Hungary, which is now Otovci, Puconci, Slovenia." Otovci/Ottóháza/Ottóc(z)-Pecsnaróc(z)/ was in the same Muraszombat District of Vas Megye=County as Puconci/Puczincz/Battyánd/ in historical Hungary, but they're not the same place. Puczincz had a Lutheran church, where parishioners from Tölgyes went. Per Ellis Island a Terez Kertsmar arr'd from Tolgzes=Tölgyes on March 25, 1906. It's interesting that Puconci also came up for you, is it the new district name in Slovenia?
Per the 1890 Hungarian Census, Ottóháza had a Total of 419 residents in 75 houses, ethnically 418 Vend/Sloven, 1 Izr., religionwise 119 R.Cath., 300 Evang.
Joseph
2004/12/28, 07:14:44
#: 200412811

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Laszlo Lipics: Re: Catherine Lipics / Lipech-Krecsmár / Kreczmár
Hi Ken!


I speek just a little English. My Name is Lipics. Can I help You?
2005/07/20, 16:53:33
#: 200507816

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Ken Forbes: Re: Catherine Lipics / Lipech-Krecsmár / Kreczmár
Thank you. I know very little about Catherine Lipics / Lipech. The name was shown on my great-grandmother's death certificate. Catherine Lipics married John Krecsmár and they were my great-grandmother's parents. Is Lipics a regional name, or can they be found throughout Hungary?
2005/07/23, 01:38:31
#: 200507938

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Laszlo Lipics: Re: Catherine Lipics / Lipech-Krecsmár / Kreczmár

I think this is a regional name from Slowenia, bat in Croatia have many people with this name,too.
In Austria lives a general Lipic.
My grandpa in 2nd worldwar dies, I can no more.
2009/01/28, 23:00:52
#: 2009011836

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